Am Dram Problems

[igloobabe]

Where's Cameron Mackintosh when you need him?

[paulears]

There are a number of issues here that aren't being talked about.

Before looking at these, it's clear she has a voice, and suits WWRY. Perfectly fine to listen too - she's got a bit of uncontrolled vibrato, that pops up in a few places, but it doesn't annoy. So she's Meat, so in WWRY, this usually tags people as one of the middle group, better than ensemble, not as good as lead. Perhaps this means she's very, very close to the lead role, or just better than the rest of the ensemble. We have no idea of the make up of the company, or their average level.

So we have somebody who doesn't have an issue with their singing. What we're left with is their acting and movement. Perhaps this is an area where she's a little more 'awkward'? What is her acting actually like? On top of this, there is another area. You say she has self esteem issues? This is very difficult, but she obviously isn't dealing too well with it. Maybe this is what is putting them off? Obviously I don't know, and am guessing, but is it possible that they are uncertain of her sticking power? I've done it myself - had a choice of two people, one of which comes across as potentially unreliable, and another who is perhaps not so good, but comes across as solid and dependable, able to be shouted at without wilting, and with no hangups? Is it possible the couple who run the organisation have seen a more tricky side to her nature.

In the professional world, I have a pretty good radar for trouble, and some very talented people worry me at audition. Do I give them the more stressful and ultra responsible role, or the lesser one I know they can do, but if they mess up I can cover?

Amateur organisations are much worse as they have history, and golden members. These are the ones who always seem to have invisible pips on the shoulder - people who get roles they don't deserve, by virtue of perhaps a committee role, or worse, they have a hold with financial or premises connections.

The reality for you is probably to either accept it, or try a different group, further away.

This is perhaps not what you wish to hear, because after all, you know your own kids - but strangers may see things very differently. Remember WYSIWYG - what you see is what you get, and you need to distance yourself from the family relationship, and try to see what a stranger sees. It's so difficult, but if this happens more than once, then something she does must be received as negative - find out what it is, and you can make headway.

It's no use everyone telling you how good she is - you already know that, and without seeing her actually perform, we're guessing. Something is preventing her getting better roles, we just need to work out what it is.

[igloobabe]

OK, I can certainly answer many of these points. Firstly, she auditioned for Meat because she wanted that song, she didn't want Scaramouche as the part didn't appeal as much. So it's not the case of not having the ability for a lead role, she has had Jasmine in Aladdin, Titania in MND, Serena in Fame, Sarah Brown in G and D, and Reno Sweeney in Anything Goes. She has never thrown a wobbly, forgotten her lines or messed up a song, which two of the three who were left in the evening show have all done on more than one occasion. She is very reliable. She did not let them see how hurt she was but waited till she was home to have the tears. The girl they have swapped her for has only just joined, and, I am told by the mum of one of the lead boys, is not as good an actress or singer. So I don't see how they could know if she's more reliable and steady at this stage.

I'm not looking for easy answers. I can't move her to another group because she doesn't want to go! She loves her friends and up until last Friday, felt totally happy and confident in her part. I just wanted to let off steam in a place where I know people will understand, because I don't have any friends who are 'into' performing.

[francescasmum]

igloobabe, we are your friends.

[Genevieve]

I dont think any of us can read too much into the whys and wherefores and negatives, because you know your dd and the other members of the Am Dram, so I'm sure you're being totally objective. I agree about Am Drams having golden members, and often roles are given because of association etc.
I totally understand though why moving to another group is totally out of the question as she's settled there and it's her social life too, and she'd not want to leave her friends. It's especially frustrating and upsetting for your dd as the other girl has only just joined, and I'm sure many of our dds have come back from similar situations like this and had a cry, our dds are passionate about these things.
I am sure your dd will indeed 'accept' what's happened, what else can she do ?, ....but it's still tough when it happens. Its a great site to let off steam and ask advice on here, and as many on here have said.....these things happen in Am Drams all the time...
Hope your dd is ok and blows them away !

[igloobabe]

Thank you all very much for your great advice and insights. And thanks F's mum, I of course should count you all as friends! I was just meaning people in my local social circle.

[jasmine2]

hello
Just read this post, and I would say it would be worth approaching the director and just having an informal chat as to why he decided to use your dd for the shows that he has..
What is the worst he can say? We have been in a similar position and sometimes you do just have to accept it, but it so worth asking...especially if you feel that she has been treated unfairly.

Good luck and let us know what you decide to do...
We are all behind you

[paulears]

I see that asking would perhaps work, but I would expect the person to simply make up something plausible. It's not in their interest to be honest, or tell exactly what happened. It's always been my practice to never reveal the truth to a parent, unless there really is no choice. Over the years I've got pretty good at it. Truth does NOT go down well. Sometimes, though, you need to be honest - and it's pretty unpleasant. You just have to work out what it is that is stopping her getting the roles you think she deserves. Are they simply being biased towards friends or other people, and turning down the better person? Who can tell - it does happen.

When I was a lecturer in a college, very often we gave the lead roles to surprise people, because the people who were 'the best' just weren't suitable for lots of reasons. Many of the leads each year never stood much of a chance against others at uni or dance/perf arts college auditions when they left us.

I'm really not trying to upset anyone - but this business is not an honest one, with fake reasons for not getting jobs/places/roles everyday practice. Somebody knows the answer - certainly not us! I do hope she gets this sorted, it could simply be a very snooty amdram company, but if she's a member, she can always raise the issue at the AGM and get a minuted response?

[igloobabe]

I think we may be talking at cross purposes about this - dd HAS been given the role she wanted. All the girls' roles are doubled up, and some of the boys. Since before Christmas they have been rehearsing, and they have always worked in the same group combination, which appeared to be working well. The director didn't place them in these groups, they just gravitated towards their peers, and became used to working with eachother and giving facial/body cues to keep the pace going.
He seems to have taken offence at them forming these groups, and with 3 weeks to go, announced he was 'mixing it up' a bit.
But the only people who have changed in this 'mix up ' are the two Meatloafs. I doubt that the other girls parents complained, because she actually preferred the boy she was originally working with!

What galls me particularly is that at the adult Glee Club run by the same couple, that I go to, I have said on several occasions how lovely it is for L to be working with her best friend as normally they are double cast, and he has smiled and nodded along!

She also does GCSE Drama with them because her school dropped Drama and Music, so she now believes she won't get a good result because they obviously think she's rubbish. (her words) She has been dreading it all week.

There is no committee, or AGM, it's just these two and a band of helpers, mainly parents.
To be honest, as I'm writing this, I'm beginning to wish she would just leave!

[riverdancefan]

Maybe that's the answer, pastures and challenges new, we have always found it ideal to move on every 2-3 years or so or experience other productions, meet new people and see how others do it. Meanwhile keeping old friendships.
You live centrally so there must be plenty of opportunities?
She seems so negative and unhappy about this.
Could be a cue to move on?, difficult with the drama GCSE but I can't believe they would mark her down, are they that unprofessional?
I don't know her of course and I do think she has a lovley voice, do you think she might be overreacting a little, as teens can do ( I know I used to)

[paulears]

The good news is that it doesn't matter a jot if they positively hate her. GCSE is a national examination and is regulated - it has moderation and quality systems built in. If these people are offering it, it's VERY unlikely they are what is called an approved centre, they will be doing it as a franchise arrangement with a school or college. They teach it, but exam entries and verification/moderation gets done by the approved centre. In every case there is copious evidence collected because if somebody asks for a remark or review, it has to be done by somebody else - who looks at just the evidence, NOT the student candidate. So if her grade is not as you expected, ask for a remark, and these characters won't be involved. They almost certainly know this, so shouldn't be stupid enough to give favour. That would be deemed unprofessional behaviour and they could lose the franchise.

Sorry if I misunderstood. Some amateur societies are just like this - locally, some young people set up their own group for this kind of reason, and they've put on some good shows with very little adult intervention/interference!

[igloobabe]

I looked into it and apparently they are a 'recognised school' for teaching GCSE and A level, whatever that means.

Last night she went to the GCSE class to do a filming/ improv assessment .
She ended up coming up with the idea for her group and it was hilarious, having everyone, including the leaders, in stitches. She has gained some confidence back from this. Now she has gone to the rehearsal, so I'm just hoping she can keep positive and show them she doesn't care.

I'm going to put this to bed now, but I really appreciate all your helpful thoughts, suggestions and advice!

[paulears]

Recognised school is not a common title, it's usually recognised centre, but it's possible that an amateur organisation or dance school could get accreditation, but to do so is complicated. They need quite a few people - somebody to teach and moderate, somebody to check and somebody else to sign the form saying it's all accurate. So the chances of mistakes are pretty rare. Plus - they get checked form the exam board, and people who assess often need to take a test themselves.

I reckon you're OK on this one.

[igloobabe]

Thanks.
The rehearsal went OK and she felt a lot better after her friends all gave her moral support, they are all a bit gutted.

On to better days hopefully.