LAMDA exams

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Flosmom
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Flosmom »

riverdancefan wrote:we thought about Lamda exams....
and have decided not to go for them at this time.
I think it's very much 'horses for courses'. Although Flo loves the structured learning and exams, Pandy has no interest whatsoever.

And I absolutely agree that we have to prioritise stuff, or when would they have time for it all? Never mind the space they need to just be a kid and do stuff that kids do.

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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by WendyB »

My DS(8) decided, when he dropped his rugby club, that he'd like to take up Lamda. We thought it would look good on his CV when applying to University - my oldest DS had very little in the way of extra-curricular stuff on his application - even though he's studying biochemistry, lamda and music grades set you apart.

Lamda fits in nicely with drama and tap on a Saturday and already he's working towards an introductory level exam. Does anyone know how quickly they usually go through the grades? Is it dependant on ability or will it generally be a grade per year until University?
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Genevieve
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Genevieve »

You can generally do a grade termly. But by the time you get to Grade 6 Bronze , it may take a couple of terms to do.
Certainly when you get to Grade 7 and 8 SIlver and Gold you definitely need minimum of two terms to learn, if not more (for Grade 8). My dd took 3 terms for her Gold because of school work and commitments. They have to do three pieces for Grades 7 and 8 -
How long each person takes just It depends on how quickly they can learn the pieces really.
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by amycompton »

If many people assume that mincing is what I have learn t at LAMDA as a method of passing the exam then it all makes sense. Thank you so much to both of you.
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obsteve
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by obsteve »

Hi,

re: "stilted"

I completely agree with pg on this one-

I have seen various young actors with distinctions and merits, certified by LAMDA, deliver what I would call "mechanical" performances.

I have begun to see it as quite stylised and mannered public speaking- it has very little to do with acting, in my experience.

Acting is about connecting, not about an extensive range of vocal variety and facial flexibility, which is what the syllabus seems to teach.
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Irishdancer
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Irishdancer »

The trouble with Lamds exams is it all depends what the examiner likes you can do one grade with one examiner and get 91 and if it was another examiner and only get a pass 70. If they are doing Lamds to gain more points for unie that's fine but it dose not make a difference when going for auditions. I was told with both my sons by directors not to do to much drama with them as they where natural actors and if they did to much drama would lose that naturalness. They only did 9 private lessons a year to do Lamda and a few festivals, Jackie who was there teacher was really good when they where working on there pieces she let them have a lot of input and a lot of the time most of it was what they had said they wanted to play it. They both did very well have very good acting CVs, oldest have acting up. What it has done for both of them they have a lot of experance so when they go for interviews be it for collage unie or for a job they make a very good impression.
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Nicola
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Nicola »

I think the discrepancy some people are talking about here is more to do with the teachers than with the exam system itself. I've read the very comprehensive marking scheme for the various grades, and LAMDA are certainly looking for truth in acting, believability in performance and well-developed characters. If some LAMDA teachers choose to teach that in a way that some would appear to (from comments on here), which leads to 6 identical performances, then that's an example of a bad teacher, not a damaged system. LAMDA exams themselves should not be the purpose of any drama coaching, they should be used as a way of making sure you're making progress within your more general drama learning.

I also think it can't be right that it is better not to have any training at all - after all, if casting directors wanted people who weren't trained, why would they cast so many people from drama schools?!

Still, as someone said earlier, it's horses for courses. For us through 6 grades in 3 disciplines, my DD has loved doing them and I would imagine will continue until she has all 8!
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by pg »

Yes. Horses for courses indeed!

I agree Nicola, I think it's a useful way of marking progress and learning new skills. A framework for progression like grades in music.

I think it is all about the right training. I don't think you can teach someone to act. I think you can teach someone to improve their craft though. The sorts of things you learn while studying and practising for LAMDA exams are likely to be very useful to you - but they could be prejudicial if you are not experienced enough to know which tools to pick out of your tool box for any particular acting job. That is why I think some CDs (especially for Film and TV) may be wary of too much "training" for young people. In some cases, people have to "unlearn" bad habits and that can be harder to do than starting from scratch. This is true of older amateur actors too.

It depends on the teacher, certainly, but it also depends on the pupil and how good their instincts are.

Acting for an exam seems to me about getting it "right". It has to be, doesn't it? Otherwise how can it be objectively marked? The teaching that leads you up to the exam might be fantastically useful and might help you to explore all sorts of really inspiring and useful things as you develop as an actor - if you are lucky and you have the right teacher. An actor would have to be very brave, or have brilliant instincts, to fly and go for broke in an exam - but I think this is what an actor has to learn to do to produce great performances - it's also what is likely to give you the best chance in an audition, though it's a tough thing to do. I think what I have seen in some people's LAMDA performances (when I have seen them as proposed audition speeches for example and they have told me they have had good marks) is meticulous preparation and great care. If you can see it (as it's being performed) it's dead - whereas these things may perhaps achieve/deserve marks or credit in an exam - a bit like getting marks for your working out in Maths exams, even if the answer is wrong. That's my take on it anyway.

However:

Ruby's original question was about how it is regarded in the profession. I think that talking about your LAMDA exams in an interview/audition would be a bit like talking about your voice classes (or any other class, come to that) in drama school. It's just part of your tool box. What matters in the audition and in work is you, the actor, and how you use the tools you have and whether you have been taught to use them correctly!

The problem I see with LAMDA exams is that it seems quite possible to achieve a high grade without knowing how to regularly and reliably give a truthful performance. It doesn't mean that the student didn't do well in the exam (and they may have given a truthful performance in the exam), but equally, having done well in the exam does not always mean that they are able to transfer skills elsewhere - or know what to ditch. Some actors will do it, of course, but not all. Since I have seen examples of this, and others involved in the profession appear to have seen it too, it makes sense not to use LAMDA exams as any kind of benchmark for professional actors. Too many people have seen people with good LAMDA grades who don't seem able to give great performances. It's not like CORGI registration for plumbers. It's not a symbol of reliability, nor a guarantee of talent - though the person who has a gold medal might well turn out to be utterly brilliant.

The same is true of drama school graduates. They are not employed because they are drama school graduates, they are employed because they are what is needed at the time. The training will have helped them develop their craft - and CDs know that they will have had good and varied training at the best schools - but it's never the school or the degree or the class prize that gets the job, it's the actor.
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Caroline A-C
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Caroline A-C »

My son was told that LAMDA was really not necessary for applying for drama school. In fact, his CV was of very little interest to the panel and how he performed was everything. Also, when interviewed, they were more interested to see what he had done, such as what he had seen etc and there was no mention about any exams of any kind whatsoever. Hope this helps a bit.
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obsteve
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by obsteve »

Some of it certainly depends on the teacher, but I think it is the syllabus which is causing the damage. I can honestly say, in my experience, that LAMDA students seem to be focused in completely the wrong areas.

In order to get higher marks, students must inevitably jump through certain assessment hoops, which clearly results in the effort made in the outward appearance of the performance, rather than the heart of it. You get derivative, imitative pieces, crafted to tick the boxes.

A lot of the problem could stem from working alone, rather than interacting with others within the drama. Monologues

I like gutsy, rough and immediate performances. I like honest, organic and natural performances. You can't achieve this when you are concentrating on a choreographed monologue.

If you can recognise a LAMDA student from their performances (and I reckon a number of us here can) then that means it's not good acting, but standardised, mannered behaviour.

Back to the OP- It's a tough question, whether to mention it or not- In answer, I believe your performance should really speak for itself, regardless of qualifications. Some people may be impressed by a distinction in drama. However, going by own experience only, seeing people hand me their LAMDA distinctions, followed by a plastic performance, only serves to highlight the discrepancy.

So no, don't mention it IMO... but your casting panel will probably be able to tell anyway, unless you are a genuinely good actor who is able to see beyond standardised matrix assessment criteria

Sorry to be so blunt, I hope it helps 8-[

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Nicola
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Nicola »

Wow Steve, you REALLY don't like LAMDA exams, do you?!

My DD used the same "derivative, imitative piece" for both her exam, a festival and (at just 14) her audition for the National Youth Theatre. All 3 loved it, so unless there's something intrinsically different with what they were all looking for compared to you, I can only assume from that that your interpretation is not necessarily the norm.

As PG has said, and as I have said before I would never dream of suggesting anyone mention it in an audition or casting situation; it's just another tool in the box, which if used correctly is, I believe, a useful one. I disagree entirely that there is something inherently wrong with both performing a monologue and doing so for an exam. The trick is to bring the truth to it every time, despite its rehearsed-ness and maybe that's something that's missing from the students you've seen, but again is something that's down to the teacher - and to an extent the pupil, not the exam.

Not every LAMDA grade 3 student has aspirations to be the next Daniel Craig, just as not every Grade 3 violin student has aspirations to be the next Nigel Kennedy. And if you ARE interested in progressing your dreams, LAMDA exams will not be the only tool you use to achieve them, but that doesn't mean they have no value. I would hate younger parents on here to be put off the system because of your assertion that it creates "plastic performances", when I truly believe there is a lot to be gained by having a structure to work around. Where else do you go as a young student to have your work / progress considered when you're 9?!
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obsteve
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by obsteve »

Hi Nicola,

I suppose I am not keen! I feel very strongly about it, too, so apologies to people if my opinions come across as contentious.

Yes, I do think there's something wrong with teaching actors in isolation. You can't generate interaction, reaction, listening, sponteneity, improvisation, focus-on-other... All you can do is choreograph a solo performance. The majority of your acting work will be interactive, so why does LAMDA teach in isolation?

Bringing the truth to a performance every time requires that you shift attention away from all the assessment criteria that will get you a distinction in LAMDA, and refocus on a completely different set of objectives.

The way I see it, if you can deliver a poor performance and still get a distinction in LAMDA (which is catagorically the case), not only is it not worth the paper it's written on, it is also mis-teaching our children to deliver poor performances.

The claim of "it is down to the teacher, and down to the student" doesn't convince me either, as-

1. Like any other skill, nearly everyone can act, if with the correct teaching.
2. LAMDA shouldn't be subcontracting teachers who can't teach.

If NYT liked your daughter, I agree she must be a good actor, (I am ex-NYT myself, and know how competitive it is). However, I would argue that LAMDA training has little to add to her skill, and IMO it is very probably giving her some bad habits which hopefully proper training at a real drama school with professional drama teachers can address.

LAMDA does create artificial performances, as others on the thread have commented- I regularly see them- I can tell a LAMDA student from a non-LAMDA one, and not in a positive way either! I reckon most people who regularly work with children can spot the LAMDA in-house style.

If I could try and define the problem further, I would say that really good actors focus on the other actors around them, in order to react. LAMDA actors are clearly focused on themselves, which is what LAMDA teaches.

Some may like it, I definitely don't- but if you can spot it as a style, I would say it isn't truthful acting, and LAMDA shouldn't be letting it happen, or worse, encouraging it.

This really is a great subject of debate!
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Re: LAMDA exams

Post by Genevieve »

I don't think it is easy to get a distinction in LAMDA exams - it's actually very tough meeting all of the different criteria, and of course it depends on what the 'one' 'examiner's like' that your dc gets on the day and whether you get a 'tough' one or not, and they're surely all rather subjective.
but I have to agree with obsteve on these examinations and their 'usefulness' to performers/performances...as I understand from a member of an audition panel for a top drama school, that they can very much 'tell' if their auditionees have done LAMDA exams as they can see that they've pick up bad habits from doing LAMDA - and may even go as far as to say that it's not worth putting it down on paper that you've even taken LAMDA examinations if you're auditioning for top drama schools, it won't do you any favours.
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