Disappointed at Local college.

[lotsolaffs]

My DD went for a taster day at a nearby college that offers BTEC in MT today. She did drama,dance and MT there.
Although it has a good reputation for performing arts for example the senior student she was looked after by has a place at Laines this September, she felt very despondent afterwards.
The facilities were very poor,some staff were good,some things they tackled were well below her capabilities, I did say that they have to take into account that some students don't have a lot of experience.
She liked the other students and really enjoyed being with others who have the same passion as her but I really think it made her realise what lies ahead and how tough it will be. I don't want to sound as though she is so talented that it isn't good enough, I was sort of hoping if she didn't get in anywhere else it wouldn't be so bad,but it might be.

[paulears]

I think maybe your expectations were just a little high - keep in mind that there is NO pre-requirement of any form of out of school arts training - so the courses are designed around the typical school leaver who has done GCSE drama, and that's about it. BTEC takes a person with no experience in real performance and can get them up to Distinction standard, ready for the next stage of their education.

If she's had out of school experience, then maybe she's at the stage of the average uni entry student already? Quite possible. She may well find the effort she needs to put in for two years a bit feeble. This is perfectly normal. BTEC will NOT stretch a typical dance school dancer, who's been doing it for years. Some students in the BTEC may never get to her standard, and some of them will achieve Distinction grades. That is what it is.

Facilities wise - some colleges are amazingly well equipped and others aren't, and rarely does it impact on grades.

It's two years, in the meantime she can be in as many local shows as she can, and college will not be stressful - apart from having to put up with the idiots. If she walks out with top grades, that's it done.

Do NOT expect a BTEC course to teach anything about professional theatre. She'll get the essentials but that's what the course is about!

[Katymac]

this was the problem we had for DD; combined with there not being enough high quality advanced classes locally

It was a nightmare for us

[lotsolaffs]

Very true Paulears, I agree with everything. We have talked about it and if she ends up going there I said we can supplement with some Easter/Summer schools,it won't be too stressful and she can carry on with her local drama club,singing and dance classes.
I have to say that they way students and parents were greeted by staff was welcoming and I felt happy leaving her ,there was some energy about the place,that in itself was a good thing. A bit of a wake up call,again not a bad thing.
Katymac your DD did well in the end,I remember reading your posts in the past,I hope she is happy!

[carriecrafts]

My DD was the same. At her BTEC audition she found it unchallenging. The principal was honest and said they could help with her singing and acting but she would be ahead of the rest of the year group in dance. She had offers from Laine, Performers and Urdang so the BTEC was her back-up plan.

She was so disappointed to not get funding from Laine and decided she would rather try again for a DaDA from there than accept one from Performers or Urdang so didn't go to their recalls. She took the BTEC and felt she would be killing time until the next audition season but it turned out to be the best thing for her. They gave her one-to-one ballet for most of the 2 years and she continued with her dance school classes and CAT class. The improvement in her performance was impressive and she built confidence in singing, widened her MT knowledge and improved in commercial and street dance which she always thought she just couldn't pull off and was dance captain in the end of year show. The standard was actually a lot higher than the open day impression, which as you say they pitch to make all abilities feel comfortable.

Her dance style changed a lot in the 2 years and she is on the BA at Urdang now which she thought was too commercial for her at 16 (she is dancing on The Voice Kids live final on Sunday so has embraced commercial!). She has had some of the same teachers on the degree as at the BTEC college. The BTEC qualification meant degree courses were an option so solved the funding issue too.

Just a bit of reassurance but I hope your dd gets where she wants anyway

[Katymac]

lotsolaffs, she is having fund - she just finished 2nd year and is booked to do Panto this Christmas!!

Good luck!

[lotsolaffs]

Thanks carriecrafts, no audition needed at this college. Sometimes I wish they let parents in too! So many things I'd like to ask. I am also being given advice from all 3 of her teachers,drama says do A levels,dance says no A levels,no BTEC go at 16 somewhere away from home,singing says we will do what is right but we won't know what that is yet ( my preference )
Great to hear others experiences,also reassuring. Thanks all.

[Robin64]

DD started a Btec performing arts at a local college 2 years ago and by the December it became clear it wasn't really right for her. Luckily she was able to change to MT at another college and the course was better although at times definitely not challenging. Very much as paulears described. However DD had outside singing lessons and kept up her dance school lessons. Also did a summer school after year 1 of the Btec. The first college had a better reputation in general but they had just changed to the UAL qualification and I think there were teething problems with this. So definitely worth scanning around to just double check any options in the locality. In the end DD enjoyed the Btec MT, made nice friends and ended up with D*D*D* which will be useful for applying for degrees or diploma courses. Fill in some of the gaps with outside dance drama singing and see it as a way of getting a useful qualification in the bag while not too stressful which is good when auditions come round too. Best of luck x

[paulears]

Initially, I was impressed with UAL, I'm not quite so impressed now - in fairness, it was a new qualification and the success was a little of a surprise.

College programmes of all kinds have a very tricky problem. They are expected by some parents to take ANY student on day one and add two years worth of education. Expectation is that this is what can happen, and frankly, often it's impossible. Current teaching guidelines simply mean that a teacher simply has to have more knowledge than the students at the standard expected for their exams/assessment. The dance teacher may have done the BTEC themselves, then spent three years at uni, and then straight back to their very own college as the dance teacher. They do not need to have danced professionally, they don't need to have even been on a stage, just as long as they are better than the kids is enough, and have the education to be able to do the paperwork and assess accurately. I cannot dance a step, and I have verified dozens of dance assessments at schools and colleges all over the country. Could I teach even 14 year olds dance? Nope, not a step! I work with dancers all the time, I understand their language, I can do accurate assessments.

If a student turns up on day one already at a high standard from their out of school previous activities, they will learn nothing - if they are already beyond the teacher's ability. The teacher spots it and the student becomes the leader, doing the choreography and being the teacher's right hand. This is perfectly normal.

Frankly - the absolute worst thing for a college is parent involvement when their kids are already good. Lotsoflaffs idea about going to the auditions is a teacher's nightmare for two reasons. It's like having an OFSTED inspector in the room, and it's a distraction. It's also a personal negative for the course teacher. The last thing they want is a pushy mum popping up for two years, asking the tricky questions and interrogating the students each day as to what they have been doing. I've had nightmare parents many times over the years, and while from this forum I know you have the kids best interests at heart - what you want, and sometimes demand, is not what can happen.

Colleges are not geared up for the advanced status many of the members of this forum expect for their children. That's perfectly fine - but sometimes the reality is that they are too far ahead of the others for the typical college. Those kids who have essentially skipped two years and gone away early are in the right places at the right time.

If it helps - musically advanced children have the same problem. A Level music and BTEC music courses have the same problem when somebody with Grade 8 saxophone or piano turns up at 16. The pianist spends two years playing for everyone else, not getting much better at all.

What does happen, and it's rarely appreciated, is that they do learn something very important, and that's how to work with people with lower ability and not let it annoy them.

BTEC is still very worthwhile as a route forward for people who know very little at the start, because they come out better. For good people, with prior skills it's a 70 odd week holiday with a qualification at the end. Back in the old days, we used to cheat a bit - we would plan some activities very near the beginning that enabled the experienced actors, singers and dancers to get to distinction standard in the specialist units in just a few weeks - in essence, completing the work in hardly any hours. This freed their timetable up allowing them to do extra units which while not being necessary for the qualification still went on the end paperwork - AND - enabled them to do useful extra stuff. We ran extra units like prosthetic makeup, technical units of all kinds and even the weirder dance units. It meant our students for about 4 years sort of got buy one, get one free units because the ones they were already good at we could cover amazingly quickly.

This flexible approach was then banned by our management, and we started on the route to bland and dull. We even managed to squeeze in a circus skill unit one year when the local amateurs had been doing Barnum - so we covered all the criteria for the unit because one group of students could all juggle, ride unicycles and walk wires!

[jennifer1972]

Has your DD ruled out A levels?

[lawn]

Thanks carriecrafts, no audition needed at this college.

I think if it's a college where an audition isn't a requirement to get a place then you are going to get those who have done little or even nothing before. Even when auditioning is a requirement, the teaching can still be hit and miss. My daughter's school drama teacher (who I don't rate) is leaving her school to go and teach at a new sixth form college. I had it on my list of possibles for the future for my DD, now I know who the teacher will be it's off the list.

I wouldn't be put off by facilities though.

[lbm1e14]

Deleted this one as posted twice in error.

[lbm1e14]

Thanks carriecrafts, no audition needed at this college.

I think if it's a college where an audition isn't a requirement to get a place then you are going to get those who have done little or even nothing before. Even when auditioning is a requirement, the teaching can still be hit and miss. My daughter's school drama teacher (who I don't rate) is leaving her school to go and teach at a new sixth form college. I had it on my list of possibles for the future for my DD, now I know who the teacher will be it's off the list.

I wouldn't be put off by facilities though.

We had a similar situation with DD but we're lucky enough that the teacher left the college she was at to go to another one! She's now head of dance there!!

Thanks for such a detailed and insightful reply paulears. It' has to be a great help to parents and students who are about to embark on post GCSE studies. As you say it's all very hit and miss and in the final analysis you have to take control and sadly pay where necessary to ensure DC is progressing sufficiently.

[lotsolaffs]

Not so sure about A levels. The school she attends now is the only 6th form for around 10 miles apart from the college where she had her trial day and it appears they are really wanting the higher attaining students which is fair enough. She can do an A level alongside the course if she wants to which she said she would like to do.
Good point about facilities too,it was more her feeling than mine.
I couldn't and wouldn't sit in on an audition! What I meant about being there was asking about hours she would attend and where students went afterwards. She didn't ask any questions nor did they tell them.
The college is Sussex Downs,Lewes campus.

[lyndahill]

Not so sure about A levels. The school she attends now is the only 6th form for around 10 miles apart from the college where she had her trial day and it appears they are really wanting the higher attaining students which is fair enough. She can do an A level alongside the course if she wants to which she said she would like to do.
Good point about facilities too,it was more her feeling than mine.
I couldn't and wouldn't sit in on an audition! What I meant about being there was asking about hours she would attend and where students went afterwards. She didn't ask any questions nor did they tell them.
The college is Sussex Downs,Lewes campus.

Hi, my DD was due to do the taster day there also last week but in the end couldn't go so I have read your post with interest. I have always heard good things about the college in itself but have heard that the MT course and the performance course isn't great - that has come from 2 people that have just finished and are moving on-they have been attending my DD's part time theatre school for many years and they felt that the courses weren't challenging enough because they had already surpassed the level. I guess I will have to rethink for my DD, however, she is trying for entry in to somewhere like Bird at the age of 16 - so September 2018. If she's unsuccessful then I would rather she took A'levels than settle for a BTEC course that won't strengthen her and continue where she is now as the part time school has had many successful students gaining places at many of the top colleges. Good luck to your DD.x